User:Valenoern/CDRW/archive/2308-05 simurgh

[revision]


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"fly-walk"  [cr. 2020-08-21T09:24:22Z]

* phoenix -> can probably stay, although making it less visually standard would be cool

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"simurgh"  [cr. 2023-08-05T05:33:02Z]

simurgh is definitely the creature of mystique similar to the Phoenix
but it seemed strange it was so easy to get the phoenix in mf2; it took a lot longer to get the wooden duck than the legendary monster there is supposed to be about one of in the world. it definitely needs to be hard to get a simurgh

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simurgh is possibly big and red just like ultraman
but if so it is a combination of ~10 monsters through means that are not usually possible
you can initially only combine two at a time, and you get access to the ability to 'overdo' combinations only later

--I can almost imagine there being a dark simurgh, creatable from 10 'darkness' monsters that aren't Simurgh, that is blamed for the event where all the monsters got imprisoned but maybe isn't actually responsible--
I won't. I've done this about five or six times but not again


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"simurgh"  [ed. 1692521413]

> by the end ... everyone's a shapeshifting powerranger & every tool is defined by its possibilities & any attempt to limit things ... is evil   [*e]

the concept of a monsterfarm-like game that seems orderly but then /unravels/ is so good

I immediately see a connection between this and the possibility Simurgh teaches you how to break the monster combination mechanic to multi-combine 10 or so monsters and obtain Simurgh for the first time.
what if /every/ monster had some kind of secret power like this such that when you’ve unlocked all of them you’ve basically broken the whole thing?

this reminds me of how Cookie Clicker has Grandmapocalypse and the Grandmas break how the game normally works up to that point   [*g]

which again has put a dumb concept joke in my head -
the contextless phrase “Granddad ruined everything”.
I’m imagining this phrase coming up ominously at odd times hinting at some sort of disasters or negative events that happened in the past. but for the longest time nobody explains it, they only look very frustrated while standing in ancient ruins areas that disappointed them or something and say “granddad ruined everything >:/”
I'm divided about whether I like that or not, I'm leaning toward not

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[ed. 1694853238]

> “Granddad ruined everything”
logically this should begin with particular main characters complaining about one particular thing their "granddad" did, but then expand to a couple other "granddads" that ruined everything

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[ed. 1695766163]

Vitarka and Vicāra are great names for main characters that are essentially investigating and analyising things  [*m]

I love the notion of taking Buddhist terms that are asking you to not use your analytical mind and toss away the notion that individual beings matter and all that,
and entirely recontextualising them in the light of a scientific method so Vitarka and Vicāra are actually a good thing.


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"simurgh"  [ed. 1692538705]

instead of a designated evil monster /every/ monster is suspicious because they all could have / will undermine the overall quest by failing to cooperate with each other.
they are all different and their strategies and goals are all a little different, so if we imagined this as a show similar to the monster rancher show the plots might revolve around trying to get them to understand each other

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[ed. 1694849849]

I think the game might actually be a light feudalism simulator where each breed of monster lives in a different area with a few other monsters common in it and you have to "solve" the small local states by doing some kind of quest so they'll be your ally. you can start at any of them that aren't the rare ones and going across the map is how you unlock each rare one. (it's actually more intuitive than monsterfarm on the surface level.)
nobody believes the local states will go to war but they really do get into pointless arguments a lot and refuse to cooperate when it would be useful.


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[cr. 1694849849]

all right.... I've gone back and forth but /maybe/ there can be a trotskyite character. i've tried to not do it again but so many things have made me think of it it's like... okay, okay   [*t]

it wasn't until the possibility of Itsuka becoming Kyōda that it really started to fit together as a "maybe". like, conceptually, Itsuka is always promising it can become something great but it's not that good at things; Kyōda is a powerful rival character which is super fast and quickly ends up ahead of you. Itsuka can be seen as cute and innocent if incompetent, Kyōda has passed the point of no return and knows what it's doing. there is a certain resemblance you can find between the two of them and in the progression

this makes me think that somehow the "bad" Kyōda was partly responsible for writing the really wrong account of the "SSSP", though maybe not entirely responsible. they have their own agenda to fulfil
after failing to cooperate with the main Simurgh team, they continued to persist either hiding in disks for long periods of time or using disks to respawn in order to live long enough to gradually become more powerful and perhaps reach further "tail levels" if those exist

I'm just going to decide now that CDRW will let you use your disk to respawn the same monster at starting stat levels instead of having to create fusion monsters, as if you were allowed to combine the same monster twice without consequences. this is convenient for people who really want to practice on a particular monster, with the drawback that some lore characters have used it for evil purposes


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[cr. 1694855377]

god, what if everybody is a monster but the main characters were one of the last few "humans", a little like in _Adventure Time_.
at the beginning, they have no idea the monsters were once the same kind of people as them, and just kind of think they live in a world of humans and dragons and gargoyles that all talk. if it's what they've always known, why would they question it?
only later do they finally find out what happened a long time ago, how apparently all the different groups of people that could have joined together instead split apart and turned into fighting monsters defending their territories from each other because they could not cooperate



## "divided" entry

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[cr. 2023-08-13T22:55:21Z]

on disks:
'divided, we could never win'

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there was once an 'sssp'
in the year 9991 it was destroyed

everybody became convinced the ssp was actually an evil organization, it's presented almost exactly as if it was moo
but this was the work of the actual big bad who created the current system and then faded into obscurity

you hear just so much propaganda against the ssp
they were so evil. they tried to destroy monsters with tanks and jets. if monsters stood up to them they would surely be destroyed
but it's all a huge misrepresentation of what really happened

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[cr. 2023-09-15T02:00Z]

I'm seeing a possible conceptual pun on "media" and "media"
"the media" have told you history one way for a certain period of time,
but now you are looking through "the media" — optical media — to find history in the media correctly



## "bridge" entry

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"bridge"  [cr. 1695526690]

today within our area for both the animal shelter and recycling centre (which you have to admit is a really weird combination of things)
I saw a display about the "rainbow bridge"
this poem is full of emotions. it's always heartwarming to see people challenge religious imagery that doesn't make sense and create something better
but it also brought my mind back to Petscop and the Gift Plane. i mean, it's literally a weird ethereally-glowing place full of pets.

i just know that if there is a rainbow bridge locale the "phoenix" has to live there
"Phoenix" is not a central character in CdrW when that role is already filled by Simurgh, so it's just another rare monster that happens to exist
"phoenix" has a strange somewhat-distorted, doodle- or sketch-like look to it, following a theme that this place has complexity to it and while it seems to have a simple explanation to it at first, it's not quite that simple
one thing that's for certain is the "phoenix" lore character is very old and remembers all its lifetimes
while others perhaps do not remember, or maybe have only had a couple lifetimes

when I try to fully envision this locale, my thoughts recall _Petscop_, _OMORI_, and _OFF_   [*p,*h,*b]
* it feels intuitive to put in the odd image of a combined haven for pets and recycling centre. it really suits "phoenix" from both angles and yet it seriously calls into question if this is a good or reliable place to be. are the pets being recycled? are they being thoughtlessly tossed into a "pet library"?
* if it's heaven, does it have recycling priests?   [*h]
* the image of bins for different materials makes me think of the arbitrary and unsettling material elements in OFF and how whole places were made of them — but not in any normal way, like steel being in dirt or rocks or meat existing as natural animals, it's instead an artificial environment

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[cr. 1695631058]

I had a thought for reasons I don't remember that "phoenix" being made of fire was weird for the rainbow bridge locale and something-else-ix would make more sense. I think I thought this because it would just be weird next to recycled materials — you don't recycle paper by burning it.
I first thought water-nix and then Coturnix (a real-life quail)
that almost works - it's Koturnix and then it's Turnix

I like "Turnix" for how dumb it is while otherwise completely and totally fitting with the theme by chance. it could be connected either to the recycle symbol or to windmills and disk spinning tools

Turnix might or might not be CDRW's counterpart to Remaliat, in a sense
its role is different, it doesn't necessarily literally make itself out of recycled materials, but it just, works there?? and is a kind of "miscellaneous things elemental"


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it is possible the rainbow bridge locale is actually the home of Memo.
Memo has certain ties in its imagery to the Gift Plane, environments that are weird and uncanny (notably, Memo itself looks unnatural), and death (blood-red markings, made of stuffed fur albeit artificial; loose connection to the layers of "recordings in Petscop" through its input device obsession and cross-shaped tool).

if so Memo might have something to do with the process of initially recording monsters to disk or respawning them as new bodies when they physically die   [*s]

possibly the creatures that live in the rainbow bridge locale are even in charge of recording and making sense of history, and trying to figure out how to not repeat the mistakes of the past and to do things better this time, although it may be this is a very secret project that most are not allowed to learn about.
now my thoughts actually go back to analysing _The Giver_. I thought at length about the nuanced differences between the Elders in this book having to make all the decisions just because society stacked up that way, and the ways that history is /actually/ analysed or edited in Marxist parties mostly just to attempt to separate people from misinformation that will give them actually-wrong models of the world.   [*a]

basically, is Memo creating "memory holes" to protect everybody until the rainbow bridge team can actually figure out what to do?
it's funny that I could entirely imagine antagonist characters that represent Trotskyism and early Maoism who just want to do the right thing to unify everyone but did it totally wrong and instead divided everyone... and they're secret rare characters, and Memo is supposed to be telling you half the truth. it seems pretty obvious that Memo is hiding the secret history of these failed attempts within its home locale.

I can entirely imagine this kind of, secret "scott pilgrim" quest where you have to uncover and defeat every one of the Failed Marxism characters.   [*md]
it's a tiny bit like the journey from the surface levels of Petscop into and through the Newmaker Plane yet once you get there there are actual boss battles

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[*a] oh god... _The Giver_ features the concept of "gifts" too. there it means some kind of weird ESP ability that people have when they're different from the rest of society. I am not sure what to do with this connection


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"bridge"  [cr. 2023-09-25T06:57:03Z]

there is a weird association between the Kirtora strain and this boss battle quest
like, maybe Kirtoras are commonly used as a sort of living training dummy, just a paper representation serving as an abstract placeholder for something that originally looked different?

I first envisioned the divisive fox antagonist as maybe Yap (Itsuka) × Kilter (Kirtora), "Two-face"
then I pictured the Maoist character as Kilter × Merge (Simurgh)
and it was like. wait, are they all Kirtora?? if so, why?

it seems to make more sense that Kirtora is some kind of fake test they unleash on new recruits while the actual antagonist characters are locked up somewhere else

it is very funny to imagine that the real counterpart to "Two-face" is locked inside a place called The Doghouse   [*d]
what's locked inside is simply the disk, and yet it still looks as if something is periodically violently thrashing around inside the building, there is a creepy dark sky above it and it's surrounded by steaming water

maybe you fight the "paper" version of "Two-face" at a model of The Doghouse and then are left to stumble onto the real one on your own, although by unspoken cues you have been warned not to go there. at the very least, that most new recruits in their right mind wouldn't go there.

I think there is the rainbow bridge locale where everything is beautiful
and then there's the "Greyed-A" bridge, which you are warned not to cross because things get darker and more dangerous as you go into there.   [*p,*h,*x]


I guess there is an implication here that "phoenix" always wanted the antagonist characters to be reformed however bad they may seem, and that's what the recycle bins and stuff actually mean

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[*d] so apparently the phrase "in the doghouse" comes from Peter Pan (1911). coincidentally right after some children were taken away   [*p]

[*x] ..."cross". I didn't even intend that but, nice


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[cr. 1695806829]

I guess there are /several/ big turns to this story

* in the first phase it's just a feudalism simulator about funny monsters that don't get along for reasons, and a few humans that mysteriously live in this land

* in the second phase you learn there's hidden history, and that it is /hinted/ but is not quite said that the monsters used to be humans. you vaguely learn about antagonists having done something to cause the division or prevent everybody from unifying but it's unclear at this point what happened

* in the third phase you cross the rainbow bridge and go through training to become a "historian", learning how bad and scary the antagonists are and how you shouldn't seek them out

* in the fourth phase you have the hardest task of all, which is to raise the antagonist characters as if they were ordinary monsters and unlock their lost potential.
this is something of an optional phase where you are not required to go into it much, as if it is more or less a postgame activity, although I'm not sure it is even the end of the story; I think you unlock it before the game is complete, and it becomes /your/ choice whether to desert the antagonist characters or try to make them your friends and use different monsters.

* I think the goals of unifying all the monster lands and discovering the secret history are two parallel tracks of story, like one is the surface gameplay and one is the "plot", but nothing really blocks your progress to make you do the story at particular times.
the game just lightly discourages you from never doing the story by gradually becoming harder, such you could get through it with skill if you wanted to, and the story is just there to help you



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[*t] it has become one of our "things" to make ~6-7 different stories about the unseen comedy of the Trotskyite conspiracy period, including the "Rise Rakulaion" plot in Asekai Sphere where an assortment of Trotskyist and Anarchist lions form into a giant robot, and "Digimon RebeL", where we imagined Digimon overthrowing the feudal system of the digital world and trying to create a new world of harmony (but "trotskyites" ruin it).


=> cookieclicker.fandom.com/wiki/Grandmapocalypse  *g
=> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omori_(video_game)        *h. OMORI ;
=> en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Off_(video_game)          *b. OFF ;
;
=> majin      *e. old/ majin thread  ; ..95702592 majin
=> paul       *p. CDRW and Petscop   ; ...4754348
=> factors    *m. Twenty unwholesome factors & two neutral factors  ; ..95762946 factors
;=> RD/scott  *md. MDem v4 scraps/ "rebuilding Marxism is a bit like Scott Pilgrim" - R.D.  ; ..85921995 scott
;
; << 1695710171  old tids/ cdrw 8.20  ; fly-walk
>> simurgh    *s. simurgh / "respawning the same monster"  ; ...1213582
>> 1691967321 divided
>> 1695526690 bridge
;    "divided", "bridge": entries specifically for past lore
;
; ATTENTION Foggy Sea staff: redact all mentions of Communism. do not let the truth escape