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Reversedragon (talk | contribs)
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Umineko and (potential spoiler) are telling the same story
Reversedragon (talk | contribs)
Bureaucrats, Conference pass, Interface administrators, Arts-aligned editors, Crimson-aligned editors, Violet-aligned editors, Administrators
17,789 edits
Stalin is basically Monokuma
 
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{{NextNineThousand|PPPA=Umineko / When They Cry|User=RD|E=Q618|NoContents=y}}
{{NextNineThousand|PPPA=Umineko; When They Cry|User=RD|E=Q618|NoContents=y}}
{{ContentWarning
{{ContentWarning
  | Umineko spoilers
  | Umineko spoilers
  | Umineko is a relatively linear story that is best experienced without spoilers (or very minimal spoilers). <strong>There may be partial spoilers up to about Episode 3 on this page.</strong>
  | Umineko is a relatively linear story that is best experienced without spoilers (or very minimal spoilers). <strong>There may be partial spoilers up to about Episode 3 on this page.</strong>
| I have put all spoilers from after the beginning of Day 2 in spoiler tags. If you mention any of these propositions in edit summaries, please use the redacted titles.
  }}
  }}
== Main entry ==
== Main entry ==
{{HueCSS}}<ol class="hue clean field_ML">
{{HueCSS}}<ol class="hue clean field_ML">


{{li|start=y|I=Z1/Fy/MX|Q=618|Q2=618}}Umineko / {{TTS|lang=ja|『うみねこのなく頃に』|title=Umineko no Naku Koro ni}}  ->  a highly unusual case of a work of fiction being violet not just due to its approach but due to its specific subject matter. I won't spoil the exact plot of the story itself on this page but see below. if you've already read the work your mind will be blown.
{{li|start=y|I=Z1/Fy/MX|Q=618|Q2=618}}Umineko / {{TTS|lang=ja|『うみねこのなく頃に』|title=Umineko no Naku Koro ni}}  ->  a highly unusual case of a work of fiction being violet not just due to its approach but due to its specific subject matter. I won't spoil the exact plot of {{em|the story itself}} on this page but see below. if you've already read the work your mind will be blown.
 
</li></ol>
 
== Unpacking the allegory ==
<ol class="hue clean  field_ML">
 
{{li|start=y|I=S2/MX/IV|tradition=|Q=618|Q2=618}}Umineko and {{book|Animal Farm}} are telling the same story / Umineko and [potential spoiler] are telling the same story (redacted title)  ->  you think I'm joking. but this is not a joke.
 
{{li|I=S1/IV|tradition=|Q=40,36|Q2=4036}}Stalin is basically Monokuma / ({{9k|RD/Q4036}})  ->  I was only able to realize after I actually started reading this that Umineko is a {{em|vastly}} better example of this. it's like, almost literally this motif as a story. it's not presented as a game show but there is an argument that when it's {{spoiler|a treasure hunt for hidden gold}} it is a kind of contest anyway.
 
{{li|I=S2/MX/IV|tradition=|Q=618|Q2=618}}Kinzo represents global capitalism / [potential spoiler] represents global capitalism (Umineko) (redacted title)  ->  hmm. I think the best thing to do with these propositions is to create an abbreviated form of the proposition that is amusingly cryptic, then explain the whole thing on a proposition page just for the individual proposition.
 
{{li|I=S2/MX/IV|tradition=|Q=618|Q2=618}}{{spoiler|Natsuhi going against Eva with a gun}} is the Moscow Trials / [potential spoilers] is the Moscow Trials (Umineko) (redacted title)


</li></ol>
</li></ol>
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<ol class="hue clean  field_ML">
<ol class="hue clean  field_ML">


{{li|start=y|I=S1/IV|tradition=|Q=618|Q2=618}}Umineko and {{book|Animal Farm}} are telling the same story  ->  you think I'm joking. but this is not a joke.
{{li|I=S2/MX|tradition=MX onto W, MX onto IV|Q=618|Q2=618}}To succeed at Gramscianism you have to be a Trotskyist / To succeed at Gramscianism ([[EC:9k/RD/Q618-MarxismAccordingToAntonioGramsci|Gramsci's Marxism]]; Gramsci's version of Bolshevism) it is necessary to hide Lattice points that are to be passed on by unaware people behind the borders of multiple countries, which in effect transforms Gramscianism into a form of Trotskyism / ({{9k|RD/Q30,52}})  ->  this proposition will seem like word salad unless you've read Umineko and then you'll understand it instantly. the way it hides this stuff almost specifically for people in multiple countries... you have to see it, but it almost explains this proposition better than a straight non-fiction explanation.
 
{{li|I=S1/MN|tradition=|Q=36,22|Q2=3622}}Communist monomyth / greatest story ever told (sense) / ({{9k|RD/Q35,17}})  ->  the motif of retelling "the story of Marxism" (as someone interprets it) like it was at least as important as the Bible.
 
{{li|I=S2/IV|tradition=|Q=618|Q2=618}}Stalinists lack literary depth / Stalinists have no imagination / It is impossible not to remark in those who have written [these Stalinist articles] an extreme weariness, a secret resignation to what exists, with the concern to keep the reader in a more or less generous illusion as cheaply as possible (Breton) [https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/1997/06/bre2-j16.html] / We maintain that the activity of interpreting the world must continue to be linked with the activity of changing the world ... it is the artist's role to study the human problem in depth in all its forms (Breton) ->  I think I found the explanation of what the hell is going on with Umineko.<br/>
for some reason, Trotskyists write party newspapers in orange and literature in violet.<br/>
not something I can have any complaints about. [[E:Q92|I just wish they'd write their newspapers in violet]].


</li></ol>
</li></ol>
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{{li|I=S1/Fy|Q=618|Q2=618}}{{TTS|Fy|fiction}} / allegorical fiction
{{li|I=S1/Fy|Q=618|Q2=618}}{{TTS|Fy|fiction}} / allegorical fiction
{{li|I=S1/MN|Q=618|Q2=618}}{{TTS|MN|M.N.}} / historical materialism in fiction
{{li|I=S1/MN|Q=618|Q2=618}}{{TTS|MN|M.N.}} / historical materialism in fiction
{{li|I=S1/MX|Q=618|Q2=618}}{{TTS|MX|meta-Marxism}} / meta-Marxism in fiction
</li></ol>
</li></ol>


Latest revision as of 23:21, 19 August 2026

Content warnings

  • Umineko spoilers
  • Umineko is a relatively linear story that is best experienced without spoilers (or very minimal spoilers). There may be partial spoilers up to about Episode 3 on this page.
  • I have put all spoilers from after the beginning of Day 2 in spoiler tags. If you mention any of these propositions in edit summaries, please use the redacted titles.

Main entry

  1. Umineko / 『うみねこのなく頃に』 -> a highly unusual case of a work of fiction being violet not just due to its approach but due to its specific subject matter. I won't spoil the exact plot of the story itself on this page but see below. if you've already read the work your mind will be blown.

Unpacking the allegory

  1. Umineko and Animal Farm are telling the same story / Umineko and [potential spoiler] are telling the same story (redacted title) -> you think I'm joking. but this is not a joke.
  2. Stalin is basically Monokuma / (9k) -> I was only able to realize after I actually started reading this that Umineko is a vastly better example of this. it's like, almost literally this motif as a story. it's not presented as a game show but there is an argument that when it's pronounced spoilers it is a kind of contest anyway.
  3. Kinzo represents global capitalism / [potential spoiler] represents global capitalism (Umineko) (redacted title) -> hmm. I think the best thing to do with these propositions is to create an abbreviated form of the proposition that is amusingly cryptic, then explain the whole thing on a proposition page just for the individual proposition.
  4. pronounced spoilers is the Moscow Trials / [potential spoilers] is the Moscow Trials (Umineko) (redacted title)

Related

  1. To succeed at Gramscianism you have to be a Trotskyist / To succeed at Gramscianism (Gramsci's Marxism; Gramsci's version of Bolshevism) it is necessary to hide Lattice points that are to be passed on by unaware people behind the borders of multiple countries, which in effect transforms Gramscianism into a form of Trotskyism / (9k) -> this proposition will seem like word salad unless you've read Umineko and then you'll understand it instantly. the way it hides this stuff almost specifically for people in multiple countries... you have to see it, but it almost explains this proposition better than a straight non-fiction explanation.
  2. Communist monomyth / greatest story ever told (sense) / (9k) -> the motif of retelling "the story of Marxism" (as someone interprets it) like it was at least as important as the Bible.
  3. Stalinists lack literary depth / Stalinists have no imagination / It is impossible not to remark in those who have written [these Stalinist articles] an extreme weariness, a secret resignation to what exists, with the concern to keep the reader in a more or less generous illusion as cheaply as possible (Breton) [1] / We maintain that the activity of interpreting the world must continue to be linked with the activity of changing the world ... it is the artist's role to study the human problem in depth in all its forms (Breton) -> I think I found the explanation of what the hell is going on with Umineko.
    for some reason, Trotskyists write party newspapers in orange and literature in violet.
    not something I can have any complaints about. I just wish they'd write their newspapers in violet.

Ideologies or fields

  1. pronounced fiction / mystery narratives
  2. pronounced fiction / aristocrat fiction
  3. pronounced fiction / fiction about Japanese history
  4. pronounced fiction / fiction commenting on a historical period
  5. pronounced fiction / allegorical fiction
  6. pronounced M.N. / historical materialism in fiction
  7. pronounced meta-Marxism / meta-Marxism in fiction

Subpages

  • commentary - my immediate thoughts while reading the work. spoilers on specific story details.
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