9k:RD/BlackRadicalTradition (Q618)

Prompt

Is Martin Luther King Jr. considered part of the black radical tradition?
I tried to look it up and all I got was two pages clearly trying to argue that he was just to obscure things and imply that social-democracy is as good as or better than Marxism. Then I saw published academic articles doing the same thing of categorizing different things that sound like social-democracy, anarchism, and Marxism all as "resistance" against "domination". But I am not sure what "the black radical tradition" would actually refer to according to most people, so I do not know if the people who study the history of this tradition would consider this kind of argument revisionist relative to it (or in some way going outside its parameters, anyway), or if "the black radical tradition" has always been this way and these arguments are authentic to it.

Motifs or claims in prompt (no AI)

Martin Luther King, Jr. [1] -> is he considered part of the "Black radical tradition" or not? if he is I will quite literally make the philosophy code for it MLK. on one hand it's okay to remember him; on the other hand the way he never got all the way to Bolshevism or the concept of revolution deserves to be exposed. making him the philosophy code nicely expresses both of those at once.

Response

The motif of grouping together social-democracy, anarchism, and Marxism as forms of "resistance against domination" is, depending on context, either part of or identical to the topics of the Black radical tradition -> wow. that explains a lot of the "Existentialist-Structuralist" motifs I was seeing. it's basically all stuff that began by grouping together all movements experienced by Black people and then as a whole got appropriated by all other groups of people again. that's a little funny. it tried to collect together and empower specifically Black people in a non-discriminatory way, but it ultimately failed at its entire premise almost because it wasn't racist. once White people started using the "glue all movements together" strategy within themselves it more or less revealed how ridiculous it always was. it's still a little tragic that the goal of creating Black organizations was forgotten in all that. it is. but it shows exactly why it's important to ask why it is that 'White people ruin everything'. is it because they don't understand the concepts or is it because the concepts were bad and were not actually objective concepts that could be applied to the specific situation of any population at all?
The Black radical tradition is not Marxism (Robinson) -> apparent argument of Robinson's book.
resistance against domination (Robinson)
standpoint epistemology (Robinson)
speaking your truth (Robinson)
race as anchor of subjectivity (Robinson)
Martin Luther King Jr. was against Black nationalism; this is to imply all forms of Black nationalism without serious investigation into what Marxism actually is
a cry of disappointment born of the wounds of despair / a cry of disappointment ... born of the wounds of despair (Martin Luther King Jr. 1967) -> that is a wonderful turn of phrase. I'll never turn away 'poetry' from a Christian (or a Buddhist, etc...) if it's good.
Putting Martin Luther King Jr. into the Black radical tradition is not against the principles or methods of the Black radical tradition, but it is dubious in context of his own organizing methods; this is to imply but not state that he would not have been part of it -> that's two propositions probably, though I don't feel like coding them right now.
The Black radical tradition does not need to be coopted by Trotskyism, because its nationalist or identity-based focus does not serve to unite large groups of workers together across a continent
The Black radical tradition does not need to be coopted by Trotskyism, because of how it blends bourgeois and proletarian movements together

Subjective themes (no AI)

Martin Luther King Jr. was a Menshevik / Martin Luther King Jr. was a center-Liberal social-democrat; was a progressive Liberal-republican social-democrat [2] -> now, the way he supported huge protests definitely wasn't nothing. there have been worse organizers. but if you look closely at this you've got reforms and bureaucrats. the government programs resemble FDR, who was absolutely not a Bolshevik. so "Menshevik" is the nicest thing you can say.
I want you to know tonight that we, as a people, will get to the Promised Land [3] -> this is worth talking about because the entire concept of a promised land is really fraught. in and of itself, it's a promise of property by people who feel they're entitled to property and entitled to cut down other people to take it. it is literally — in the text of the bible — the promise of Israel. and trying to claim the promise of Israel in the real world has not gone well; it's generated a whole new Israeli nazism against Arabs after the defeat of the first one. so... what does it accidentally imply when MLK says it? it seems to imply some sort of eternal continuation of class society where the same type of chunk competition that occurs in ancient empires or in capitalism will always occur, instead of being able to stop it or make it irrelevant.
revolutionaries (Menshevism) / Martin Luther King Jr.'s legacy has been diluted in mainstream narratives, often reducing him to a symbol of peaceful protest and integration -> this page is trying too hard. the people "diluting" it are much closer.
tradition of radical blackness (blue anarchism) / tradition of radical blackness, as opposed to Cedric Robinson's black radical tradition ... statist authorities have variously targeted this progressive praxis as communism [4] -> stop.
King's critical theory of racial capitalism / We set out to reconstruct King's critical theory of racial capitalism [5]
Prophet of Discontent: Martin Luther King Jr. and the Critique of Racial Capitalism [6] -> this book counts as one of the "articles" to me. there were also two journal article links I didn't save.

Usage notes

You are allowed to post LLM prompts as prototype pages (the part you wrote manually), as long as they stay in one of the ... talk: (pronounced Talk) namespaces and there are no direct quotes from generated text. Concisely describing abstract propositions that turn up several times inside response text — or quoting source texts written by humans — is fine.
It's recommended you include all of the AI's "references", such that each prompt becomes a sort of 'combination nickel' that becomes a convenient place for collecting twenty or so links that answer the question. If any of the pages referenced are already nickel pages, you should link the nickel page.
None of the commentary on these pages after the motif names / arrows is AI.

Links

Ideologies, fields, topics, or search engines

pronounced Trotskyism / Socialism AI
pronounced Fourth / Trotskyism
pronounced RedGreen / Black Marxism
pronounced RedGreen / Black radical tradition
pronounced L-R / Martin Luther King, Jr.