9k:RD/ China fearmongering (Q618)

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618. Q618/Q618

     CPC fearmongering

     / China fearmongering -> I need a page to put all these dumb claims about China on. this will do
618. Q618/Q618CPC fearmongering / oppressive Chinese regime (generic) / China's authoritarian government (generic) / Communist China (said in derogatory tone; generic)
618. Q618/Q618CPC fearmongering (Trotskyism) -> most of the time this is blue or brown but occasionally it's orange.
     to be fair, Trotskyist sources that actually claim to be Leninist are usually trying their hardest to come up with reasons that China doomed itself to Deng Xiaoping Thought and that whatever specific thing they think on any particular day caused Deng Xiaoping Thought is illegitimate. which is admittedly less bad than the way United States publications attempt to criticize China; on their worst days it at least strongly resembles Marxism.

Claimed Chinese genocides

618. The CPC is conducting three genocides / The Chinese Communist Party is currently conducting three genocides — against the Uyghur Muslims, Falun Gong practitioners, and Tibetan Buddhists — through mass detention, torture, cultural eradication, and forced organ harvesting (Epoch Times) [1] -> I cannot believe I'm at a point where I don't even take anticommunist accusations the least bit seriously and when I read this statement too fast I said in irony "but what about the Uyghurs, you can't forget them ;)". nah they got that one in there. the thing that gets me though is how they seemed to be carefully holding back the urge to call persecuting Christians the 'fourth' genocide and just say there were four
618. The CPC is persecuting Christians / The regime is escalating its war on Christianity, arresting pastors, and crushing underground churches (Brownback) [2]
618. The CPC is conducting three genocides -> note: I don't take this so flippantly that I truly feel that there is 0% possibility of genocides or persecutions happening in China. that is why I titled this "claimed" genocides and didn't go for a word like "supposed" or "purported". that said every actual specific claim I've seen made a really bad argument for what it was arguing. I wish the arguments would be more believable, that's all.
618. China has effectively been attempting to eradicate Uighur traditions / China has been effectively attempting to eradicate Uighur language, culture, and tradition (Mia Hasenson-Gross) [3] [4] ->
     so... let's keep in mind that out of 12 million Uighurs, at most 1 million are subject to this 'genocide effort'. that is a high number, but it's also a rather small fraction to be a genocide. in order to be "comparable to Nazi Germany", which is what the director says, it would have to be some 70-100% of Uighurs in concentration camps. but it's only 8%. so it's not comparable to Nazi Germany.
     let's put things in perspective: a bit under 1% of the United States Black population is put in prison. [5] many people are (rightfully) upset about this and consider it already a high percentage, whether they're crazy people like Tucker Carlson or they actually want to help do something constructive to solve the problem. but nobody has successfully drawn up a plan for the African-American subpopulation to become independent from the United States... despite most people across the U.S. political spectrum actually agreeing that the United States government is not serving them well and they deserve independence, either in a positive sense of inclusion or a negative sense of exclusion. one of the big reasons is that it could be the case that there is a greater proportion of people who want to kick them out and basically ban them from the country in that negative sense. if these kinds of people get to dictate policy over another population of people, you basically get Israel; you get an empire that rules over a minority through exclusion and an angry population of minority people who will build a second violent empire and possibly go kill people or destroy all their buildings to secure a safe place to be. so, whether people are able to quite articulate that concept or not, they get afraid of Black people not being ruled over by the United States and its stock of "Joe Bidens" or "White settler leaders" and get really insistent that either the Democratic Party will protect minority ethnic subpopulations and they must be loyal to the Democratic Party regime or that if everybody becomes anarchists Rhizome will somehow glue the country's populations together properly and fix everything. even though the Democratic Party lets Israel go on and isn't doing anything to stop racist cops from profiling Black people and putting 1% of them in prison. so, the Democratic Party versus the Black subpopulation and the CPC versus Uighurs is more comparable than you might think.
     10% is a very high percentage of a group of people to be thrown in prison. I won't deny that. but that's assuming the figure is true and not exaggerated, when it's entirely possible the figure is an overestimate that blows the number up more than twice as big as it really is. this is starting to look like the loose alliance between the 1930s Trotskyite conspiracy and the Ukrainian SSR. the Trotskyite conspiracy and the Ukrainians each decided for different reasons that if people were suffering while being part of the USSR — despite those two things not even necessarily being related! — then it's good to break a country or political party of people out of the USSR and create something else. this proved to be a really bad decision for both of them. when the USSR was dissolved, as the Trotskyites were unknowingly pushing for, it pretty much liquidated the populations themselves bringing economic destruction and migrations to other countries, not to mention the countries separating and becoming less functional as smaller isolated territories than they were when connected (a point Trotskyists still go on about without realizing their strategies cause it). when Ukraine was made independent, it no longer had any protection from Russia simply deciding to invade it and digest Ukraine and turn it into more Russia. people will complain about "Russification" inside the USSR, but the truth is, the presence of the USSR at least created some possibility for political control over that process and the ability to stop it. if there's no government extending over both Russia and Ukraine, then there's no process capable of telling Russia to stop killing Ukrainians or making those actions illegal; the act of killing Ukrainians becomes more or less just a legal and normal practice. if anyone pretends otherwise, it's all just a smokescreen to hide the possibility that the United States wants to become the unofficial government of Ukraine and effectively turn it into a U.S. territory within a world-sized state, like Greenland is a territory of Denmark despite consisting of 90% Inuit people that should have no interest whatsoever in Danish politics. that's what's being hidden here. the world is still in a warring states period of countries trying to annex other countries to their kingdoms, and nothing has been able to stop it, not the United Nations, not Bolshevism, not people going on and on about anarchism or postcolonial theories. any argument about Xinjiang is one big colonial argument of whether it should be part of China or part of the United States. and let me tell you, the way we treat Muslims in the United States, you don't want it being part of the United States.
     sidenote: the discussion over this kind of stuff changes if you separate "Zinovievists" from "real Trotskyism". if Trotskyists actually created a really big civilization of like 100 countries, it's theoretically conceivable that things like the United States and China fighting over Xinjiang or historically the battle between Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union over Poland would be over. however, what Trotskyists don't tell you is that that doesn't really create an end to political discourses over "colonialism" and "oppression", because those conflicts are caused by which groups of people are combined together into populations or separated. so if Trotskyism was suddenly created tomorrow, the kinds of arguments that are going on right now about Black people or Xinjiang would still be happening, they would just be happening in a different form in which people had fully come to understand that you can't just 'remove government' or 'separate populations' to fix a problem and you truly have to negotiate the ongoing relationships between populations recognizing those interactions and relationships as inevitable to actually get the state of one ethnic group bossing around another ethnic group "gone".

Supply chains

618. self-contained supply chains in China -> these are pretty remarkable, and yet it seems the new strategy is to try to tear this apart claiming it to be an evil plan.
618. China put pharmaceutical starting ingredients and assembly next to each other in order to torment the United States by withholding pharmaceutical exports [6] -> I can't take this claim seriously in a world where people still think it's okay to withhold stuff from Cuba. like, no, this is the way the unending cold war is fought now — countries have to threaten each other in order to not be dominated, they have to have a missile or a missing shipment of goods in their back pocket, and that's now part of the definition of what a sovereign government is. it has become that the ability to sabotage someone else's society when you don't like it is what is "democratic".
618. the lack of U.S. government oversight of Chinese pharmaceutical manufacturers is staggering [7] -> listen to yourself as you say that! that statement reveals a lot about what the United States thinks governments are and who is supposed to rule who.
     the second thing that gets me about this: they're getting upset about the use of low-quality cheap ingredients. after the US outsourced most of its manufacturing to a poorer Third-World country. that it threatened for not letting the US conquer its workers and required to take the supply chains. I swear a big part of the United States' political philosophy amounts to "punish countries for being poor until they become rich but somehow still obey our orders". like at the end of the day a capitalist is just a bossy little dictator that comes and beats you for not building businesses and becoming rich. the part where capitalists actually try to own the capital people make has become somewhat immaterial to them, now they just do violence to nationalities because they like to see lots of goods flow across markets I guess. a big part of it seems to be molding national cultures in order to have more allies in wars while leaving a few countries that are the most resistant in medieval conditions so they can be punished the hardest by all the blue countries.
618. American-made in Cuba / American-made in Thailand / American-made in China / (9k) -> the motif of efforts to "make things in the United States" being inherently connected to efforts to lay down United States corporations and corporate owners in Third-World countries, although the two things look like opposites on the surface.
618. In 1960, the United States refused to buy sugar from Cuba if it was not produced by U.S. people [8] / (9k)

The CPC audits schools

618. The CPC periodically audits university professors' houses every three months to demonstrate dominance [9]
618. The CPC randomly inserts midterm exams into school lesson plans to demonstrate dominance; this is to imply that the authority of the government of China over the area of China unfairly dominates teachers [10]

Only the CPC is against AI

618. Q618/Q618Any protest against LLMs was started by the CPC in order to give China a head start on AI [11] -> hmm. this is... innovative, but not true. I rate this conspiracy theory 5/10.

China isn't real

618. The CPC controls China but isn't the real China [12] -> how do you even determine what the real China is? really think about that. back in the time China had emperors some people probably thought the emperors could be the real China. so why is it that now in the age of republics people are so obsessed with with finding the real United States or the real China like that actually means anything? it's one thing to try to construct the concept of a generalized dictator and try to get rid of that, but I feel like people who outright say "not the real China" at least partly mean exactly what they say.
618. People living in China are deceivers who act to destroy the United States by undermining its cybernetic power of Free Will because they're all required to serve the agenda of the central government and they couldn't possibly be thinking for themselves [13] -> I can't believe people will say this in zero irony and yet think it's stupid for the historical Soviet Union to have hope in its system and tell people not to let outside forces convince you it's failing. either Stalin can tell the whole country of workers and peasants to have hope and reject foreign narratives or nobody can including the United States.
618. nation-state as stupid idiot garbage trash / we've been treating them like a normal country / This is an evil regime. They've killed more of their own people than any other regime in the history of mankind, and we’ve been treating them like a normal country (Brownback) [14] -> this is one of the most sinister ways to refer to a country in terms of how deep an ulterior motive it implies in the people talking about it
     like, anyone on earth could say this about the United States, and could say it quite fairly. now what are you going to do to the United States to solve that problem? war? what kind of new government would be installed? I have never heard any actual answers to that. and that's the easy road; you don't have to know any Marxism and can propose something fully within world bourgeois society. proposing a change to China that won't make the world objectively worse and lead to more wars and national hatred can only be harder than that, not easier.
618. United States leaders have tiptoed around human rights and religious freedoms in China -> I really don't think they have. I think all three of these have been relatively consistent talking points across the United States for anyone who speaks against China [15]
618. Human rights and religious freedom are the CPC's deepest vulnerability [16] -> I don't think that's true either. 1) have you forgotten about the tanks? if they truly were a "repressive regime" then you're not going to get very far with mere morality appeals. 2) I would guess their deepest vulnerability is when people claim they aren't following Maoism, because they have basically no good argument against that, like, you could unite all the world's Communists around just the statement that the CPC isn't following Maoism if not around anything else.
618. BRICS is one big conspiracy by an alliance of Generalized Dictators -> by this point, people who argue against China are so fucking (pronounced censored) unconvincing at putting together a coherent point that makes any sense that if China actually was oppressive I still wouldn't believe them

Related

618. Q618/Q618Toynbee tiles and Soviet Union -> the things the Toynbee tiler said and the things the Epoch Times says are not actually that different when you think about it.

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[9k] China fearmongering - Q618 ; CPC/CCP fearmongering ; The CPC is conducting three genocides ; self-contained supply chains in China