Editing Ontology:Q36,67

{{HueCSS}}<!-- {{BopCSS}} --><ol class="hue clean compound"><li>  {{ArticleTitle|Nothing should be done unless everybody considers it wonderful / The ends, the means - ES / Q36,67}}
<onlyinclude><dfn class="field_exstruct manual" data-dimension="S2" data-qid="36,67" data-field="" data-series="" data-work="" data-chapter="" data-tale="" data-object="" data-note="" data-lexeme="">{{IS2}}{{#if: {{{1|}}} | [[E:Q36,67|{{{1}}}]] | [[E:Q36,67|Nothing should be done unless everybody considers it wonderful]] }}{{WaveScore|sum=1|quilt=1|ply=1|enddfn=1}}</onlyinclude>
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== Core characteristics ==

<dl class="wikitable hue">
{{HueClaim |P=item type| {{Template:S2}} }}
{{HueRoster|EP=PPPA/L|lang=en| {{E:Q36,67}} | [[E:Nothing should be done unless everybody considers it wonderful]] }}
{{HueClaim |EP=PPPA|lang=en| Nothing should be done without a reason everybody on earth considers wonderful | The ends cannot justify the means | The reason for doing something can never justify the method used to do it | "they had such good reasons for doing what they did that the ends justify the means" | Is some particular set of goals enough to justify a particular plan to achieve it? (rhetorical question) }}
{{HueRoster|EP=P42| {{Ontology:Q3666}} }}  <!-- en: QID references -->
{{HueRoster|EP=P42| Free Will }}  <!-- en: color swatch references -->
{{HueRoster|EP=P3| -- }}  <!-- en: subset of -->
{{HueRoster|EP=P4| assumption used in storytelling }}  <!-- en: instance of -->
{{HueRoster|EP=P5| -- }}  <!-- en: superset of -->
{{HueRoster|EP=P14| -- }}
{{HueRoster|P=relevant quote| -- }}
{{HueRoster|P=[[User:Reversedragon/FirstNineThousand|prototype]] notes| [RD is] so sick of this phrase and its use in analyzing both fiction and reality. there are so many wrong assumptions in it that are difficult to dig up at first, but whenever anyone uses this concept it always totally distorts their view of how reality really works. you get so many crazy propositions out of this like that it's absolutely not allowed to investigate how reality works without obeying metaphysics, etc. }}
</dl>

=== Component claims ===

<dl class="wikitable hue">
{{HueRoster|P=model combines claims| When the subject simply is, it compels people to listen }}
{{HueRoster|P=model combines claims| ?? }}
</dl>

== Wavebuilder combinations ==

<dl class="wikitable hue data_wavebuild three">  
{{WaveBuild| {{E:Q36,67}} | prejudice in science | science Tories }}  <!-- en: Along With, Produces  ??  ?? -->
{{WaveBuild| {{E:Q36,67}} | political alignment | {{Ontology:Q3777}} }}  <!-- en: Along With, Produces  ??  democulture proposition -->
</dl>

=== Wavebuilder characterizations ===

<dl class="wikitable hue data_wavebuild three">  
{{WaveBuild| Shenlong effect | {{E:IBE}} | {{E:Q36,67}} }}  <!-- en: From  Shenlong effect  "I believe that everybody" statement -->
</dl>

== Background / usage notes ==

Ubiquitous throughout what most people term "philosophy" is the vague statement, repeated over and over everywhere, that actions can for some reason be understood in terms of "ends" and "means". This concept is one big heap of nonsense. Try to bring this idea into reality and actually apply it to any real individual, and you will quickly run into the [[Ontology:Q776|Vegeta effect]], or worse, end up watching two factions of people argue with each other back and forth from either direction about which group is on "the right side of history" and which one is the most evil group of people ever purely for not supporting the other group of people's efforts no matter what means are used to achieve them. In real-world situations, the notions of "the ends" and "the means" simply do not apply. Why?

It becomes easier to analyze why this concept is distinctly fictional rather than real if we rephrase the statement. What are ends? Ends are goals. What does it entail to justify a set of means? It implicitly entails justifying the set of ends or goals which the means are used to achieve. What is wrong with trying to justify a set of goals? Somebody else might have a problem with those goals. Why would people have a problem with each other's goals? Because they have conflicting goals. Why do people have conflicting goals? Because they assign different meanings to themselves and all the other people around them versus the meanings of those same people that some other person would assign. Why do people at different vantage points all label the same people with different significances? Because people believe that individual will directly shapes a person's relationship with the world and the future. But, given that individuals are individual, there is no reason not to assume that individuals can believe or want absolutely anything. If individuals all want potentially different things, and they all get to interpret their own life and their impact on the entire rest of the world through what they individually want and interpret parts of the world to be, then to say that any particular individual will ever be able to understand that their interpretation of the world or their intended goal is "unjustifiable" according to someone else is very likely to turn out to be a false assumption. "[[Ontology:Q42|I have the ability to make my own meaning]]," will be the summary of what anybody actually confronted under the accusation of justifying unjustifiable ends will say. And then the entire discussion will shift into an argument over whether you have any right to limit another person's inherent personal granted-from-birth Freedom, whether any particular person's Free Will at any given moment inevitably counts as a form of countable Culture and demographic identity, and whether you are in fact <i>a bigot</i> for not allowing people to believe whatever they want and do whatever they believe.

Well this is a complete and utter mess, isn't it? Perhaps it would have been worth [[E:hyper-philosophy question|asking yourself]] if the ends of persuading people not to believe in detestable ends [[E:Q36,67#top|were best pursued by these particular means]].

[unfinished]


[[Category:Existential materialism ontology]] [[Category:Text pages containing experiments]]